1 On [[todo/auto-create_tag_pages_according_to_a_template]], [[chrysn]]
4 > Instead of creating a file that gets checked in into the RCS, the
5 > source files could be left out and the output files be written as
6 > long as there is no physical source file (think of a virtual underlay).
7 > Something similar would be required to implement alias directive,
8 > which couldn't be easily done by writing to the RCS as the page's
9 > contents can change depending on which other pages claim it as an alias.
11 `add_autofile` could be adapted to do this, or a similar API could be
14 This would also be useful for autoindex, as suggested on
15 [[plugins/autoindex/discussion]] and [[!debbug 544322]]. I'd also like
16 to use it for [[plugins/contrib/album]].
18 It could also be used for an [[todo/alias_directive]].
22 > All [[merged|done]] --[[Joey]]
24 --------------------------
26 [[!template id=gitbranch branch=smcv/ready/transient author="[[smcv]]"]]
31 * `ready/tag-test`: an extra regression test for tags
33 * either `transient-relative` or `transient-relative-api`: avoid using `Cwd`
35 > merged the latter --[[Joey]]
36 * `ready/transient-aggregate`: use for aggregate
38 * `ready/transient-autoindex`: optionally use for autoindex,
39 which is [[!debbug 544322]] (includes autoindex-autofile from
40 [[todo/autoindex should use add__95__autofile]])
41 > merged. I do note that this interacts badly with ikiwiki-hosting's
42 > backup/restore/branch handling, since that does not back up the
43 > transientdir by default, and so autoindex will not recreate the
44 > "deleted" pages. I'll probably have to make it back up the transientdir
46 * `ready/transient-recentchanges`: use for recentchanges
48 * `ready/transient-tag`: optionally use for tag (includes tag-test)
51 I think this branch is now enough to be useful. It adds the following:
53 If the `transient` plugin is loaded, `$srcdir/.ikiwiki/transient` is added
54 as an underlay. I'm not sure whether this should be a plugin or core, so
55 I erred on the side of more plugins; I think it's "on the edge of the core",
58 Pages in the transient underlay are automatically
59 deleted if a page of the same name is created in the srcdir (or an underlay
60 closer to the srcdir in stacking order).
62 With the additional `ready/transient-tag` branch,
63 `tag` enables `transient`, and if `tag_autocreate_commit` is set to 0
64 (default 1), autocreated tags are written to the transient underlay.
65 There is a regression test.
67 With the additional `transient-autoindex` branch,
68 `autoindex` uses autofiles. It also enables `transient`, and if
69 `autoindex_commit` is set to 0 (default 1), autoindexes are written to
70 the transient underlay. There is a regression test. However, this branch
71 is blocked by working out what the desired behaviour is, on
72 [[todo/autoindex_should_use_add__95__autofile]].
74 > I wonder why this needs to be configurable? I suppose that gets back to
75 > whether it makes sense to check these files in or not. The benefits of
78 > * You can edit them from the VCS, don't have to go into the web
79 > interface. Of course, files from the underlays have a similar issue,
80 > but does it make sense to make that wart larger?
81 > * You can know you can build the same site with nothing missing
82 > even if you don't there enable autoindex or whatever. (Edge case.)
84 >> I'm not sure that that's a huge wart; you can always "edit by
85 >> overwriting". If you're running a local clone of the wiki on your laptop
86 >> or whatever, you have the underlays already, and can copy from there.
87 >> Tag and autoindex pages have rather simple source code anyway. --s
89 > The benefit of using transient pages seems to just be avoiding commit
90 > clutter? For files that are never committed, transient pages are a clear
91 > win, but I wonder if adding configuration clutter just to avoid some
92 > commit clutter is really worth it.
94 >> According to the last section of
95 >> [[todo/auto-create_tag_pages_according_to_a_template]], [[chrysn]] and
96 >> Eric both feel rather strongly that it should be possible to
97 >> not commit any tags; in [[plugins/autoindex/discussion]],
98 >> lollipopman and [[JoeRayhawk]] both requested the same for autoindex.
99 >> I made it configurable because, as you point out,
100 >> there are also reasons why it makes sense to check these
101 >> automatically-created files in. I'm neutral on this, personally.
103 >> If this is a point of contention, would you accept a branch that
104 >> just adds `transient` and uses it for [[plugins/recentchanges]],
105 >> which aren't checked in and never have been? I've split the
106 >> branch up in the hope that *some* of it can get merged.
108 >>> I will be happy to merge transient-recentchanges when it's ready.
109 >>> I see no obstacle to merging transient-tag either, and am not
110 >>> really against using it for autoindex or aggregate either
111 >>> once they get completed.
112 >>> I just wanted to think through why configurability is needed.
115 >> One potentially relevant point is that configuration clutter only
116 >> affects the site admin whereas commit clutter is part of the whole
117 >> wiki's history. --[[smcv]]
119 > Anyway, the configurability
120 > appears subtly broken; the default is only 1 if a new setup file is
121 > generated. (Correction: It was not even the default then --[[Joey]])
122 > With an existing setup file, the 'default' values in
123 > `getsetup` don't take effect, so it will default to undef, which
124 > is treated the same as 0. --[[Joey]]
126 >> Fixed in the branches, hopefully. (How disruptive would it be to have
127 >> defaults take effect whenever the setup file doesn't set a value, btw?
128 >> It seems pretty astonishing to have them work as they do at the moment.) --s
130 >>> Well, note that default is not actually a documented field in
131 >>> getsetup hooks at all! (It is used in IkiWiki.pm's own `getsetup()`, and
132 >>> the concept may have leaked out into one or two plugins (comments,
135 >>> Running getsetup at plugin load time is something I have considered
136 >>> doing. It would simplify some checkconfig hooks that just set hardcoded
137 >>> defaults. Although since dying is part of the getsetup hook's API, it
138 >>> could be problimaric.
141 autoindex ignores pages in the transient underlay when deciding whether
142 to generate an index.
144 With the additional `ready/transient-recentchanges` branch, new recent
145 changes go in the transient underlay; I tested this manually.
147 Not done yet (in that branch, at least):
149 * `remove` can't remove transient pages: this turns out to be harder than
150 I'd hoped, because I don't want to introduce a vulnerability in the
151 non-regular-file detection, so I'd rather defer that.
153 > Hmm, I'd at least want that to be dealt with before this was used
154 > by default for autoindex or tag. --[[Joey]]
156 >> I'll try to work out which of the checks are required for security
157 >> and which are just nice-to-have, but I'd appreciate any pointers
158 >> you could give. Note that my branch wasn't meant to enable either
159 >> by default, and now hopefully doesn't. --[[smcv]]
161 >>> Opened a new bug for this, [[bugs/removal_of_transient_pages]]
164 * Transient tags that don't match any pages aren't deleted: I'm not sure
165 that that's a good idea anyway, though. Similarly, transient autoindexes
166 of directories that become empty aren't deleted.
168 > Doesn't seem necessary, or really desirable to do that. --[[Joey]]
170 >> Good, that was my inclination too. --s
172 * In my `untested/transient` branch, new aggregated files go in the
173 transient underlay too (they'll naturally migrate over time). I haven't
174 tested this yet, it's just a proof-of-concept.
176 > Now renamed to `ready/transient-aggregate`; it does seem to work fine.
179 > I can confirm that the behavior of autoindex, at least, is excellent.
180 > Haven't tried tag. Joey, can you merge transient and autoindex? --JoeRayhawk
182 >> Here are some other things I'd like to think about first: --[[Joey]]
184 >> * There's a FIXME in autoindex.
186 >> > Right, the extra logic for preventing autoindex pages from being
187 >> > re-created. This is taking a while, so I'm going to leave out the
188 >> > autoindex part for the moment. The FIXME is only relevant
189 >> > because I tried to solve
190 >> > [[todo/autoindex should use add__95__autofile]] first, but
191 >> > strictly speaking, that's an orthogonal change. --s
193 >> * Suggest making recentchanges unlink the transient page
194 >> first, and only unlink from the old location if it wasn't
195 >> in the transient location. Ok, it only saves 1 syscall :)
197 >> > Is an unlink() really that expensive? But, OK, fixed in the
198 >> > `ready/transient-recentchanges` branch. --s
200 >> >> It's not, but it's easy. :) --[[Joey]]
202 >> * Similarly it's a bit worrying for performance that it
203 >> needs to pull in and use `Cwd` on every ikiwiki startup now.
204 >> I really don't see the need; `wikistatedir` should
205 >> mostly be absolute, and ikiwiki should not chdir in ways
206 >> that break it anyway.
208 >> > The reason to make it absolute is that relative underlays
209 >> > are interpreted as relative to the base underlay directory,
210 >> > not the cwd, by `add_underlay`.
212 >> > The updated `ready/transient-only` branch only loads `Cwd` if
213 >> > the path is relative; an extra commit on branch
214 >> > `smcv/transient-relative` goes behind `add_underlay`'s
215 >> > back to allow use of a cwd-relative underlay. Which direction
216 >> > would you prefer?
218 >> > I note in passing that [[plugins/autoindex]] and `IkiWiki::Render`
219 >> > both need to use `Cwd` and `File::Find` on every refresh, so
220 >> > there's only any point in avoiding `Cwd` for runs that don't
221 >> > actually refresh, like simple uses of the CGI. --s
223 >> >> Oh, right, I'd forgotten about the horrificness of File::Find
224 >> >> that required a chdir for security. Ugh. Can we just avoid
225 >> >> it for those simple cases then? (demand-calculate wikistatedir)
228 >> >>> The reason that transientdir needs to be absolute is that it's
229 >> >>> added as an underlay.
231 >> >>> We could avoid using `Cwd` by taking the extra commit from either
232 >> >>> `smcv/transient-relative` or `smcv/transient-relative-api`;
233 >> >>> your choice. I'd personally go for the latter.
235 >> >>> According to git grep, [[plugins/po]] already wants to look at
236 >> >>> the underlaydirs in its checkconfig hook, so I don't think
237 >> >>> delaying calculation of the underlaydir is viable. (I also noticed
239 >> >>> [[bugs/po:_might_not_add_translated_versions_of_all_underlays]].)
241 >> >>> `underlaydirs` certainly needs to have been calculated by the
242 >> >>> time `refresh` hooks finish, so `find_src_files` can use it. --s
244 >> * Unsure about the use of `default_pageext` in the `change`
245 >> hook. Is everything in the transientdir really going
246 >> to use that pageext? Would it be better to look up the
247 >> complete source filename?
249 >> > I've updated `ready/transient` to do a more thorough GC by
250 >> > using File::Find on the transient directory. This does
251 >> > require `File::Find` and `Cwd`, but only when pages change,
252 >> > and `refresh` loads both of those in that situation anyway.
254 >> > At the moment everything in the transientdir will either
255 >> > have the `default_pageext` or be internal, although I
256 >> > did wonder whether to make [[plugins/contrib/album]]
257 >> > viewer pages optionally be `html`, for better performance
258 >> > when there's a very large number of photos. --s
260 >> >> Oh, ugh, more File::Find... Couldn't it just assume that the
261 >> >> transient page has the same extension as its replacement?
264 >> >>> Good idea, that'll be true for web edits at least.
265 >> >>> Commit added. --s
267 --------------------------
269 ## An earlier version
271 I had a look at implementing this. It turns out to be harder than I thought
272 to have purely in-memory pages (several plugins want to be able to access the
273 source file as a file), but I did get this proof-of-concept branch
274 to write tag and autoindex pages into an underlay.
276 This loses the ability to delete the auto-created pages (although they don't
277 clutter up git this way, at least), and a lot of the code in autoindex is
278 probably now redundant, so this is probably not quite ready for merge, but
279 I'd welcome opinions.
281 Usage: set `tag_underlay` and/or `autoindex_underlay` to an absolute path,
282 which you must create beforehand. I suggest *srcdir* + `/.ikiwiki/transient`.
284 Refinements that could be made if this approach seems reasonable:
286 * make these options boolean, and have the path always be `.ikiwiki/transient`
287 * improve the `remove` plugin so it also deletes from this special underlay
289 >> Perhaps it should be something more generic, so that other plugins could use it (such as "album" mentioned above).
290 >> The `.ikiwiki/transient` would suit this, but instead of saying "tag_underlay" or "autoindex_underlay" have "use_transient_underlay" or something like that?
291 >> Or to make it more flexible, have just one option "transient_underlay" which is set to an absolute path, and if it is set, then one is using a transient-underlay.
292 >> --[[KathrynAndersen]]
294 >>> What I had in mind was more like `tag_autocreate_transient => 1` or
295 >>> `autoindex_transient => 1`; you might conceivably want tags to be
296 >>> checked in but autoindices to be transient, and it's fine for each
297 >>> plugin to make its own decision. Going from that to one boolean
298 >>> (or just always-transient if people don't think that's too
299 >>> astonishing) would be trivial, though.
301 >>> I don't think relocating the transient underlay really makes sense,
302 >>> except for prototyping: you only want one, and `.ikiwiki` is as good
303 >>> a place as any (ikiwiki already needs to be able to write there).
305 >>> For [[plugins/contrib/album]] I think I'd just make the photo viewer
306 >>> pages always-transient - you can always make a transient page
307 >>> permanent by editing it, after all.
309 >>> Do you think this approach has enough potential that I should
310 >>> continue to hack on it? Any thoughts on the implementation? --[[smcv]]
312 >>>> Ah, now I understand what you're getting at. Yes, it makes sense to put transient pages under `.ikiwiki`.
313 >>>> I haven't looked at the code, but I'd be interested in seeing whether it's generic enough to be used by other plugins (such as `album`) without too much fuss.
314 >>>> The idea of a transient underlay gives us a desirable feature for free: that if someone edits the transient page, it is made permanent and added to the repository.
316 >>>> I think the tricky thing with removing these transient underlay pages is the question of how to prevent whatever auto-generated the pages in the first place from generating them again - or, conversely, how to force whatever auto-generated those pages to regenerate them if you've changed your mind.
317 >>>> I think you'd need something similar to `will_render` so that transient pages would be automatically removed if whatever auto-generated them is no longer around.
318 >>>> -- [[KathrynAndersen]]