More information:
-* It can be found in [my "po" branch](http://repo.or.cz/w/ikiwiki/intrigeri.git?a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/po): `git clone git://repo.or.cz/ikiwiki/intrigeri.git`
-* It involves adding three hooks to ikiwiki core.
-* It is documented (including TODO and plans for next work steps) in `doc/plugins/po.mdwn`, which can be found in the same branch.
+* It can be found in my "po" branch:
+ `git clone git://gaffer.ptitcanardnoir.org/ikiwiki.git`
+* It is self-contained, *i.e.* it does not modify ikiwiki core at all.
+* It is documented (including TODO and plans for next work steps) in
+ `doc/plugins/po.mdwn`, which can be found in the same branch.
* No public demo site is available so far, I'm working on this.
My plan is to get this plugin clean enough to be included in ikiwiki.
but I'm prepared to hear various helpful remarks, and to rewrite parts of it as needed.
Any thoughts on this?
+
+> Well, I think it's pretty stunning what you've done here. Seems very
+> complete and well thought out. I have not read the code in great detail
+> yet.
+>
+> Just using po files is an approach I've never seen tried with a wiki. I
+> suspect it will work better for some wikis than others. For wikis that
+> just want translations that match the master language as closely as
+> possible and don't wander off and diverge, it seems perfect. (But what happens
+> if someone edits the Discussion page of a translated page?)
+>
+> Please keep me posted, when you get closer to having all issues solved
+> and ready for merging I can do a review and hopefully help with the
+> security items you listed. --[[Joey]]
+
+>> Thanks a lot for your quick review, it's reassuring to hear such nice words
+>> from you. I did not want to design and write a full translation system, when
+>> tools such as gettext/po4a already have all the needed functionality, for cases
+>> where the master/slave languages paradigm fits.
+>> Integrating these tools into ikiwiki plugin system was a pleasure.
+>>
+>> I'll tell you when I'm ready for merging, but in the meantime,
+>> I'd like you to review the changes I did to the core (3 added hooks).
+>> Can you please do this? If not, I'll go on and hope I'm not going to far in
+>> the wrong direction.
+>>
+>>> Sure.. I'm not completly happy with any of the hooks since they're very
+>>> special purpose, and also since `run_hooks` is not the best interface
+>>> for a hook that modifies a variable, where only the last hook run will
+>>> actually do anything. It might be better to just wrap
+>>> `targetpage`, `bestlink`, and `beautify_urlpath`. But, I noticed
+>>> the other day that such wrappers around exported functions are only visible by
+>>> plugins loaded after the plugin that defines them.
+>>>
+>>> Update: Take a look at the new "Function overriding" section of
+>>> [[plugins/write]]. I think you can just inject wrappers about a few ikiwiki
+>>> functions, rather than adding hooks. The `inject` function is pretty
+>>> insane^Wlow level, but seems to work great. --[[Joey]]
+>>>
+>>>> Thanks a lot, it seems to be a nice interface for what I was trying to achieve.
+>>>> I may be forced to wait two long weeks before I have a chance to confirm
+>>>> this. Stay tuned. --[[intrigeri]]
+>>>>
+>>>>> I've updated the plugin to use `inject`. It is now fully self-contained,
+>>>>> and does not modify the core anymore. --[[intrigeri]]
+>>
+>> The Discussion pages issue is something I am not sure about yet. But I will
+>> probably decide that "slave" pages, being only translations, don't deserve
+>> a discussion page: the discussion should happen in the language in which the
+>> pages are written for real, which is the "master" one. --[[intrigeri]]
+>>
+>> I think that's a good decision, you don't want to translate discussion,
+>> and if the discussion page turns out multilingual, well, se la vi. ;-)
+>>
+>> Relatedly, what happens if a translated page has a broken link, and you
+>> click on it to edit it? Seems you'd first have to create a master page
+>> and could only then translate it, right? I wonder if this will be clear
+>> though to the user.
+>>
+>>> Right: a broken link points to the URL that allows to create
+>>> a page that can either be a new master page or a non-translatable
+>>> page, depending on `po_translatable_pages` value. The best
+>>> solution I can thing of is to use [[plugins/edittemplate]] to
+>>> insert something like "Warning: this is a master page, that must
+>>> be written in $MASTER_LANGUAGE" into newly created master pages,
+>>> and maybe another warning message on newly created
+>>> non-translatable pages. It seems quite doable to me, but in order
+>>> to avoid breaking existing functionality, it implies to hack a bit
+>>> [[plugins/edittemplate]] so that multiple templates can be
+>>> inserted at page creation time. [[--intrigeri]]
+>>>
+>>>> I implemented such a warning using the formbuilder_setup hook.
+>>>> --[[intrigeri]]
+>>
+>> And also, is there any way to start a translation of a page into a new
+>> lanauge using the web interface?
+>>
+>>> When a new language is added to `po_slave_languages`, a rebuild is
+>>> triggered, and all missing PO files are created and checked into
+>>> VCS. An unpriviledged wiki user can not add a new language to
+>>> `po_slave_languages`, though. One could think of adding the needed
+>>> interface to translate a page into a yet-unsupported slave
+>>> language, and this would automagically add this new language to
+>>> `po_slave_languages`. It would probably be useful in some
+>>> usecases, but I'm not comfortable with letting unpriviledged wiki
+>>> users change the wiki configuration as a side effect of their
+>>> actions; if this were to be implemented, special care would be
+>>> needed. [[--intrigeri]]
+>>>
+>>>> Actually I meant into any of the currently supported languages.
+>>>> I guess that if the template modification is made, it will list those
+>>>> languages on the page, and if a translation to a language is missing,
+>>>> the link will allow creating it?
+>>>>
+>>>>> Any translation page always exist for every supported slave
+>>>>> language, even if no string at all have been translated yet.
+>>>>> This implies the po plugin is especially friendly to people who
+>>>>> prefer reading in their native language if available, but don't
+>>>>> mind reading in English else.
+>>>>>
+>>>>> While I'm at it, there is a remaining issue that needs to be
+>>>>> sorted out: how painful it could be for non-English speakers
+>>>>> (assuming the master language is English) to be perfectly able
+>>>>> to navigate between translation pages supposed to be written in
+>>>>> their own language, when their translation level is most
+>>>>> often low.
+>>>>>
+>>>>> (It is currently easy to display this status on the translation
+>>>>> page itself, but then it's too late, and how frustrating to load
+>>>>> a page just to realize it's actually not translated enough for
+>>>>> you. The "other languages" loop also allows displaying this
+>>>>> information, but it is generally not the primary
+>>>>> navigation tool.)
+>>>>>
+>>>>> IMHO, this is actually a social problem (i.e. it's no use adding
+>>>>> a language to the supported slave ones if you don't have the
+>>>>> manpower to actually do the translations), that can't be fully
+>>>>> solved by technical solutions, but I can think of some hacks
+>>>>> that would limit the negative impact: a given translation's
+>>>>> status (currently = percent translated) could be displayed next
+>>>>> to the link that leads to it; a color code could as well be used
+>>>>> ("just" a matter of adding a CSS id or class to the links,
+>>>>> depending on this variable). As there is already work to be done
+>>>>> to have the links text generation more customizable through
+>>>>> plugins, I could do both at the same time if we consider this
+>>>>> matter to be important enough. --[[intrigeri]]
+>>>>>
+>>>>>> The translation status in links is now implemented in my
+>>>>>> `po`branch. It requires my `meta` branch changes to
+>>>>>> work, though. I consider the latter to be mature enough to
+>>>>>> be merged. --[[intrigeri]]
+
+>> FWIW, I'm tracking your po branch in ikiwiki master git in the po
+>> branch. One thing I'd like to try in there is setting up a translated
+>> basewiki, which seems like it should be pretty easy to do, and would be
+>> a great demo! --[[Joey]]
+>>
+>>> I've merged your changes into my own branch, and made great
+>>> progress on the various todo items. Please note my repository
+>>> location has changed a few days ago, my user page was updated
+>>> accordingly, but I forgot to update this page at the same time.
+>>> Hoping it's not too complicated to relocated an existing remote...
+>>> (never done that, I'm a Git beginner as well as a Perl
+>>> newbie) --[[intrigeri]]
+>>>>
+>>>> Just a matter of editing .git/config, thanks for the heads up.
+>>>>>
+>>>>> Joey, please have a look at my branch, your help would be really
+>>>>> welcome for the security research, as I'm almost done with what
+>>>>> I am able to do myself in this area. --[[intrigeri]]
+>>>>>>
+>>>>>> I came up with a patch for the WrapI18N issue --[[Joey]]
+
+I've set this plugin development aside for a while. I will be back and
+finish it at some point in the first quarter of 2009. --[[intrigeri]]
+
+> Abstract: Joey, please have a look at my po and meta branches.
+>
+> Detailed progress report:
+>
+> * it seems the po branch in your repository has not been tracking my
+> own po branch for two months. any config issue?
+> * all the plugin's todo items have been completed, robustness tests
+> done
+> * I've finished the detailed security audit, and the fix for po4a
+> bugs has entered upstream CVS last week
+> * I've merged your new `checkcontent` hook with the `cansave` hook
+> I previously introduced in my own branch; blogspam plugin updated
+> accordingly
+> * the rename hook changes we discussed elsewhere are also part of my
+> branch
+> * I've introduced two new hooks (`canremove` and `canrename`), not
+> a big deal; IMHO, they extend quite logically the plugin interface
+> * as highlighted on [[bugs/pagetitle_function_does_not_respect_meta_titles]],
+> my `meta` branch contains a new feature that is really useful in a
+> translatable wiki
+>
+> As a conclusion, I'm feeling that my branches are ready to be
+> merged; only thing missing, I guess, are a bit of discussion and
+> subsequent adjustments.
+>
+> --[[intrigeri]]